January 7, 2009

The Israel Rant (2009 edition)

The usual disclaimers:

Hamas is a terrorist organization.
Living in Gaza does not make you a member of Hamas.
Israel has a right to defend itself from imminent attack.
Israel does NOT have the right to murder innocent civilians while defending Israel.

I have stayed quiet up until now partly because this isn’t my fight.

Let’s recap. So far, Israel has killed civilians, kept the press from entering to see the extent of the damage, and now, despite being told by the United Nations that the location was a UN school, they bombed it anyway.

I think what I am supposed to say is that I am “deeply concerned” with this turn of events.

Was Hamas firing from the school? Israel said yes. Excuse me if I don’t believe it.

An AP photographer who got to the scene reported that people gathered at the school because they thought it would be safe. The civilians thought the school was safe because nobody was firing at troops from there. Witnesses say they saw Hamas positions a few streets away from the school.

If Israeli soldiers are on the ground and near Gaza city, why they didn’t check out the school is a mystery to me. Israel must have been monitoring the position. They clearly knew the civilians were inside and fired anyway.

If a government fires at a position and it knows it will kill civilians, is it a war crime?



I also wonder aloud if Peter Kent REALLY said that the civilians in that school were asking to get bombed? Not everybody in Gaza is Hamas. Some of them just want to live....




Photo: Ismail Zaydah/Reuters

As for those Qassam rockets the Palestinians are firing, here is a result of one of them...



Photo: Anja Niedringhaus/Associated Press

I'm sure i will be seeing holes bigger than that in Montreal when the snow melts. Seems like Montreal winters do more damage than these rockets...thats probably why in the last few years, Montreal's winters have killed more people than these rockets...

I guess I cant say that about Israeli mortar rounds now can I...

Can Israel defend itself? Yes

Do they need to kill thousands of civilians to do it? No

They should put away the mortar shells to swat this mosquito

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21 Commentaires:

Blogger whopitulia a dit...

I think we passed "deeply concerned" a while back. Thanks for the excellent post.

1/07/2009 1:47 p.m.  
Blogger Mark Francis a dit...

If armed Hamas members hole up within a civilian location, should not the matter be treated like a hostage situation?

1/07/2009 2:07 p.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

i never saw a bank holdup where police blew up the bank with the hostages inside.

1/07/2009 2:19 p.m.  
Blogger Emerys a dit...

Yet your hero sounds just like Harper and Bush, hard to believe he used to be considered an expert on human rights..

1/08/2009 6:04 a.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

haha emerys

the real test is what he says when they ask him the question in French!

but jokes aside, im a little disappointed he didnt take a more balanced approach. You dont see anybody trying to accuse Sarkozy of sympathizing with hamas...

mind you, with people like Cherniak and Kinsella, sarkozy probably is a hamas sympathizer

1/09/2009 12:32 a.m.  
Blogger Werner Patels a dit...

Was Hamas firing from the school? Israel said yes. Excuse me if I don’t believe it.

Well, you'd better believe it, because according to Palestinian witnesses, this is what their MO looks like.

1/09/2009 4:22 p.m.  
Blogger Blues Clair a dit...

So Werner, Hamas and Israel potentially have committed war crimes. Sounds about right.

1/10/2009 1:53 a.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

I don't believe for a second that Israel targets civilians. Do you?

1/10/2009 9:31 a.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

Mahmoud as-Shatat, 23, a former student leader for Fatah, agrees. "Hamas consider us infidels," he said. "They brutalized us, their own people. I have no sympathy for them."

And what of the pictures on TV showing the ordinary people of Gaza being shelled?

"Hamas shoots from between houses," Mr. as-Shatat said. "They hope Israel will fire at them and kill some civilians."

1/10/2009 9:31 a.m.  
Blogger Cherniak_WTF a dit...

the real test is what he says when they ask him the question in French!
I imagine it will be a little like Harper having two different dialogues...

1/11/2009 11:10 a.m.  
Blogger Emerys a dit...

I don't believe for a second that Israel targets civilians. Do you?

No, they are just very very very clumsy...whooops I did it again! There have been very few countries in history so adept at "accidentally" killing civillians.

Yeah, I hear you Antonio, I was hoping Ignatieff would have been a bit more nuanced as well, even the non-political people in my life have woken up on this one, Israel's apologists are sounding shriller and more shameless than ever, but they have no other choice, they are too committed to defending apartheid and occupation to stop now.

It used to be 10 Palestinians had to die for every Israeli, now its 100, I think they will be singing the same song when its 1000.

1/12/2009 9:23 a.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

There is no occupation of Gaza - NADA.

Israel withdrew in 2005 yet the rocket fire continues.

1/12/2009 9:29 p.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

The Doctor

I dont know if youre so blinded by your zeal, but Israel is kind of occupying Gaza right now...

1/13/2009 7:32 a.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

And honestly, I think Israel does target civilians cuz they dont care.

If they can get 1 terrorist but have to kill civilians in the process, I have no doubt they would do it.

They havent shied away from it in the past. Why would they start now. Israel marches to the beat of its own drum.

1/13/2009 7:34 a.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

Antonio you are so wrong.

1/13/2009 10:23 a.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

can you tell me how exactly Israel is not occupying Gaza right now as their armies enter Gaza City?

1/13/2009 12:28 p.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

The Hague Convention of 1907 is very specific about what constitutes "occupation".

A military operation in Gaza by Israel does not constitute occupation.

1/13/2009 1:27 p.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

So what is the term for "bombing it back to the Stone Age and killing a bunch of civilians in the process"

1/13/2009 1:35 p.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

It is tragic that civilians are killed.

It is imperative that Hamas not be allowed to fire rockets or re-arm.

It is a crime that they have embedded themselves in the midst of a civilian population. It is a crime that they have placed munitions in schools and mosques.

1/13/2009 3:50 p.m.  
Blogger Antonio a dit...

it is also a crime to kill the civilians to get to the terrorists Doctor.

Hamas was not hiding in that school. They were several streets away.

The footage leaked from the Israeli army was exposed as being very very old footage.

1/13/2009 4:21 p.m.  
Blogger The Doctor a dit...

Not sure how you would know that Hamas was "several streets away".

IDF Spokesman has stated categorically that two Hamas gunmen fired mortars from within the school area.

Further they found the bodies of two Hamas fighters (they were brothers.

Hamas is pleased each time a civilian is killed (on either side). Israel regrets the loss of civilian life.

1/13/2009 4:50 p.m.  

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